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| Clutch Issues/stiff gear change? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 28 2014, 10:08 PM (1,755 Views) | |
| BroughSuperior | Jun 28 2014, 10:08 PM Post #1 |
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Commoner
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Hi guys. This is my first post. I'm new to the forum having just acquired a superb 2001 604e with only 5k on the clock! Trouble is having got round most service issues apart from the belt, engine runs fine but when I ride it it's very difficult changing gear, actually almost impossible at times. I've adjusted the clutch per Haines method ie resistance then back off 1/8 turn, tried it per CCM manual centre bolt play 5mm, and resistance and back off 1\4, 1/2, 1, 2 turns etc, etc. Some of these adjustments are marginally better than others but still nowhere near acceptable and impossible whatever adjustment used to select neutral without turning motor off. Apart from that the clutch is clearly dragging in whatever adjustment. When I select first you can tell there is resistance on the engine although not sufficient for it to creep forward with clutch pulled in if I'm sitting on the bike. The bike had been sitting for approx 2 years but oil has been changed for a semi synth and well warmed up many times now so I do not think it would be stiction on the clutch plates. Only other thing to mention would be the rear drive chain is due for renewal and being honest I haven't checked it's adjustment yet. Can anyone help me with some suggestions/idea what problem could be. Cheers Ps gearbox seems to select gears OK when engine not running Pps. Is the gearbox on the Rotax usually pretty smooth or notchy anyway? |
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| Monty | Jun 29 2014, 07:28 AM Post #2 |
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Charlie Big Banana's
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Welcome to the site, slacken the clutch cable at the lever, adjust the screw in the casing by slackening the nut, adjust screw till touching then back out 1/8 turn, tighten nut, adjust cable at lever. Have you adjusted the span on the clutch lever? you have 4 settings, if on lowest setting lever will not pull much, to adjust, push lever away from bars, then turn dial to a different number then release lever, keep adjusting till lever is farther away from bars, this will give you more pull and hopefully the clutch will clear |
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If it aint sharp I can play with it My Utube Channel, lots of bike vids here. Subscribe if you likehttp://www.youtube.com/user/choppermark?feature=watch
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| Cuz | Jun 29 2014, 08:23 AM Post #3 |
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God
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The chain needs to be adjusted between 55 and 65mm measured upwards from the top of the swinger at the rear of the chain slipper (sticky up bits) It will look slack but you wreck the gearbox bearing if run to tight. Was the bike running on semi synth beforehand. The plates don't like to cross over from mineral to semi or vica versa |
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| RB636 | Jun 29 2014, 09:40 AM Post #4 |
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Potato Farmer
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My bets are on oil level... semi synth wont help either unless as stated it has always had it in. Easy to put too much oil in, ive done it myself once. Plan of action for me would be making sure I have as much lever pull as possible, then i would drain the oil and measure how much was in there. |
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| BroughSuperior | Jun 29 2014, 10:06 AM Post #5 |
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Commoner
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Hi guys. Many thanks for the suggestions. I've tried most of the things you said apart from the chain. Not sure what oil was in before, I changed that straightaway as a precaution when I got the bike. I managed to get an owners booklet off fleabay the other day and I've just read this morning that overfilling can cause problems. I'll also check that as it may have too much in. Unfortunately won't get a chance to do these until next week but will post up results when tried. However is it normally a sweet gearbox? Thanks again. |
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| RB636 | Jun 29 2014, 12:46 PM Post #6 |
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Potato Farmer
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Also rotax gearbox is a work of art so there's definitely something not right. |
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| BroughSuperior | Jun 29 2014, 01:27 PM Post #7 |
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Commoner
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Hi guys. Many thanks for the suggestions. I've tried most of the things you said apart from the chain. Not sure what oil was in before, I changed that straightaway as a precaution when I got the bike. I managed to get an owners booklet off fleabay the other day and I've just read this morning that overfilling can cause problems. I'll also check that as it may have too much in. Unfortunately won't get a chance to do these until next week but will post up results when tried. However is it normally a sweet gearbox? Thanks again. |
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| RB636 | Jun 29 2014, 04:42 PM Post #8 |
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Potato Farmer
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Best gearbox ive had by miles, even when pushing silly power, you wont break it unless you really mess up. |
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| BroughSuperior | Jul 6 2014, 10:00 PM Post #9 |
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Commoner
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Hi Guys, Managed to get some time in the garage today and carried out a few of your suggestions. As you thought I had over filled with oil. My first oil change had come out of a 4 litre can and there was only 1 litre left in there so I'd obviously put 3 in!! I syringed out approx 0.5-0.6 litres, re adjusted the clutch centre bolt out 1/8 turn with correct play at lever. Pulled clutch in, selected 1st and it engaged with only a minor clunk. It was obviously still slightly dragging but not enough for the bike to creep forward. Still couldn't get it to select neutral again. However, took it for a road test and noticed how up changes were noticeably smooth, except every so often you had to be revving hard in 1st before it would snick through neutral into 2nd, after that it would move up through the box smoothly and positively. Down shifts though were very notchy not like upshifts, and still neutral can't be selected. I can only get neutral by pulling in the clutch in gear, then turning the ignition off. When the engine stops the bike moves back slightly because presumably it has stopped dragging. Not sure where to turn next. As I said in my first post the bike had been standing for approx 2 years before I bought it and I wonder if some of the clutch plates are stuck together on old oil. Any suggestions would be welcome and pointers to a hassle free clutch removal if that's your advice. Thank you. |
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| BroughSuperior | Jan 14 2016, 11:25 PM Post #10 |
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Commoner
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Hello everyone, As you can see its well over a year since I last posted here, but four bairns, job and other projects have got in the way! Needless to say after the great help of all the members below but with no significant improvement to the clutch problem I decided to get in there and investigate, strip the clutch etc. What I found with the help of Gary at Sportax Racing was that a previous owner had been in and missed out one of the two thrust washers in the clutch assembly causing the whole assembly to float too much creating the drag. Fortunately no other components were knackered. I now have a sweet clutch and faultless gearchanges. I hope this creates a new line of enquiry for those still suffering similar problems. Finally, I cannot overplay the help received from Gary at Sportax. Always happy to take calls and even send photos of his own engine strips to show how and where the relevant bits went. Good on you Gary and apologies its taken me so long to get this on a post. www.sportaxracing.co.uk Finally, as it's now time to consider taking to the trails can any of you give me ideas for the best combination of front and rear sprocket sizes and chain length for green laning? All the best for 2016 Simon |
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| Lardmarc | Jan 15 2016, 04:49 AM Post #11 |
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Jester
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It's amazing how disorganised some people are when taking things apart. A previous owner had put the washers back in the wrong order turning the clutch into a switch. No amount of adjustment would make the clutch work smoothly so it had to come apart. It's been fine since going back together correctly. Some people shouldn't be allowed to own tools. |
| Just a flunky along for the ride. | |
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| Monty | Jan 15 2016, 08:46 AM Post #12 |
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Charlie Big Banana's
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I run 14/43 on my trail wheels |
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If it aint sharp I can play with it My Utube Channel, lots of bike vids here. Subscribe if you likehttp://www.youtube.com/user/choppermark?feature=watch
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| jonny h | Jan 15 2016, 06:39 PM Post #13 |
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this is how i roll!
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it depends really, is this just a trail bike or do you run SM wheels too, i disliked swapping front sprockets when changing between the two, so i ran a 15t up front , then a 48 or 50t on the rear |
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| BroughSuperior | Jan 16 2016, 12:20 AM Post #14 |
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Commoner
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Hi guys, Yeah my thoughts exactly. It doesn't take much to put the bits in a tin and label them for reassembly. Thanks for tip Monty. Johnny H it's running on trail wheels only and will do a fair amount of road work as well. Cheers Simon |
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| Sarge | May 21 2016, 07:47 AM Post #15 |
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Knight
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Hi All, A new owner of the 644 DS but I have a similar problem with gear changing, there is a clunk when letting the clutch out and drive is taken up. So I put the bike up on stand and put it in first gear, then rotating the back wheel with the chain still on there was about 5-10 degrees of rotation on the output shaft, no wear on the sprocket ? I bought a clutch case gasket and filter kit yesterday ready to start the investigation, I am hoping it is a similar clutch basket issue ?? Any known issues to look out for ??? Sarge Edited by Sarge, May 21 2016, 07:49 AM.
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